[alamosaddles]

This post is for the benefit of BruceA4. Everyone has asked repeatedly that the No Business with a Badge and Gun thread be killed. Please respect everyones wish, they are sick of that thread and you are just fanning that flame.

On the Katrina issue you posted:

QUESTION those who agreed & executed lawful orders????? How about they needed their jobs...how about they swore an oath....how about they needed to feed their families....How about they just plain & simply needed to do what they had too?????????????
How dare you question them.........

Ordering the confiscation of legal firearms from citizens who own them lawfully, is not a lawful order.

If the NOLA police chief issues an order tomorrow, that all black people who reside off of Carandolet Street have their homes searched without search warrants, would you endorese such an act and order? Just because it is given by the Chief does not make it lawful, specially when it's as blatant as confiscating legally owned guns.

If you need your job, and the Chief tells you to go arrest anyone worshipping at a mosque, you will do it, so that you don't loose your job??

I dare question them, because they failed to use their common sense...Again, when many other LE agencies and officers refused to take part in the confiscation....they should have immediately questioned the legality of the order.

QUESTION those who agreed & executed lawful orders????? How about they needed their jobs.....how about they needed to feed their families....How about they just plain & simply needed to do what they had too?????????????
How dare you question them...:

You have left NO doubt with your above comment, that if tomorrow the state you live in said, all guns are illegal, go confiscate them all...You would be first through the doors of innocent, law abiding citizens homes stealing their guns. I want to see how many board members defend your position that the confiscation was legal, and that the order was legal.

I guess you only support the second amendment as lit applies to you, not the rest of America. Nice

 

[Rory]

how about ethics????????

i guess all those involved in worldcom or tyco or enron that were not just the big wigs should have no issue or guilt or blame as they were just doing their jobs and had families to feed.


r

 

[alamosaddles]

how about ethics????????

i guess all those involved in worldcom or tyco or enron that were not just the big wigs should have no issue or guilt or blame as they were just doing their jobs and had families to feed.


r

Rory, I just think everyone that believes in the second amendment should express serious concern with BruceA4's comment on the lawfulness of the confiscation and the order to confiscate. As much as I disagreed with him on the taser incident, I certainly did not think he was for totalitarian rule. A stance like that is what I would expect from Adolf Hitler and the likes.

 

[comanderfritz]

Sie Ich war nur folgende Aufträge

 

[alamosaddles]

Sie Ich war nur folgende Aufträge

Help...I no speakie german?

 

[ww2willysjeep]

Sie Ich war nur folgende Aufträge

We were only following orders.......???

 

[alamosaddles]

We were only following orders.......???

Ahh, thanks....I tried to google it, but dang it...all of the results were in Nazi speak.... I was getting frustrated there for a while.

I have always found that to be one of the biggest copouts in excuses ever. It goes hand in hand and shares the same indifference with "I only work here".

 

[Rory]

i am with you.... and this applies to troops as well. there are lines that you just don't cross. if you were given orders to do something that you shouldn't and you do it... everyone involved should be dealt with. same in corporations. it is all pretty sad who people are such lemmings.


r

 

[Shattered]

I was getting frustrated there for a while.

Try this then...

Wohles Coastie, wie Sie mögen sie Äpfel?

 

[alamosaddles]

This quote belongs in THIS thread

Please stop you paranoid nut!!! Do you know how difficult it is to become a cop nowadays? Do you think a cop should just give up his job/career because you don't like the laws they enforce! Not a change bud! We don't make the laws, we are sworn to uphold them! Not being a cop, you wouldn't understand.....

gggggggggg

 

[alamosaddles]

BruceA4 and his support of gun confiscating

Please stop you paranoid nut!!! Do you know how difficult it is to become a cop nowadays? Do you think a cop should just give up his job/career because you don't like the laws they enforce! Not a change bud! We don't make the laws, we are sworn to uphold them! Not being a cop, you wouldn't understand.....

The difficulty in passing the background and psych exam is irrelevant here. If anything, it bolsters the argument. If you pass the required exams to become a police officer, then you have showed (or should have showed) the ability to THINK and to make competent and rational decisions.

No, no one thinks a "cop" should give up his job or career as you indicate. You state "because you don't like the laws they enforce" That is key. They are to enforce "laws", which would be a LAW that was passed by the legislature or perhaps by Congress. The police chief has NO authority to create a "law" on his own whim, which is what he did.

Please show or point out to us ignorant folk, what statute or ordnance in New Orleans allows or calls for confiscation of legally owned firearms.

You could also show us what law or statute gives the police chief the authority to supercede and to invalidate the United States Constitution, and to temporarily cancel the civil rights of American citizens.

Perhaps the police chief in New Orleans was granted absolute legislative authority to suggest, draft, perfect, implement and then enforce laws at his own discretion. Showing us where that is written would help.

A police officer is sworn to uphold the law, but that law must have been properly passed and put into place. He CANNOT uphold a law that DOES NOT EXIST.

 

[alamosaddles]

Traitors walk amongst us

A traitor would sell out his own country for money. A traitor would betray his "people" for money. A traitor in Nazi Germany would turn in his Jewish friends for favors or money from the Nazi government....

Ha..ha....U funny... ....you don't bite the hand that feeds you....

So you will do it, because they will pay you money.......You will trample on the Constitution because they give you a paycheck.

That is the same as being a traitor. Nice

 

[alamosaddles]

Katrina post by Lucky #13

Please stop you paranoid nut!!! Do you know how difficult it is to become a cop nowadays? Do you think a cop should just give up his job/career because you don't like the laws they enforce! Not a change bud! We don't make the laws, we are sworn to uphold them! Not being a cop, you wouldn't understand.....

zzzzzzzzzz

Well let me tell you. I know someone who was a very good cop. He spent many years as a training officer for a major law enforcement agency. Most every trainee he failed got recycled by the department and was given a badge, despite his evaluations. Every time, they would eventually have to fire them. Apparently it's not that hard to become a cop in some departments. Perhaps that's because so few quality people want to do the job. I respect anyone who goes on this career path for the right reasons. Blindly following orders in violation of the Constitution is not one of them. Sucking up to "the hand that feeds you" if you are asked to do something unethical and unlawful, as was done during the Katrina debacle, merely shows that one has no moral center to guide one through a difficult decision. Having a badge doesn't give you that. It just gives you authority and power, not scruples. You either have that or you don't, long before you are on the job.

Doing the right thing is always worthwhile, even if it costs you your job. The order to disarm civilians in N.O. was NOT a lawful order, as you have stated. Following it was NOT doing your job. In case you missed it, the courts stopped that activity (thank you NRA, on this one) and ordered guns returned, even to the point of holding the city's attorney in contempt for failure to cooperate. Unfortunately, most guns were deliberately tagged without the owners names, many owners were not allowed to write down their serial numbers before surrendering their guns, and the officers frequently left their names and the location of the siezures off the tags, even though that information was to be specified. Don't give us that **** about having to follow orders. These cops couldn't even follow procedures properly. Nor was any care taken to safeguard citizens' property after it was siezed without proper identification.

And just to confirm the presence of California officers in the illegal, unconstitutional efforts, many evidence tags DID show the California DOJ as the agency siezing the weapon, even if no officer's or owner's name was listed. Just go check with the NRA if you have any questions about that. That information is direct from their publication.

 

[47lincsled]

gun grabs

What I've always wondered about the Katrina incident was weather they went into the areas that were controled by gangs? Or did they just grab the guns from the people they knew they could get them from without facing return fire, as far as I'm concerned the whole thing was a victim disarmament and relocation experiment.

 

[KpdPipes]

Without the attendant "Even one is too many" Argument..does onyone know HOW many guns were confiscated from PEOPLE during the whole thing?? I was there for 2 weeks, and while we DID Secure firearms we only took ONE gun from a person..and taht person was a drunk idiot who had gotten his ass kicked in a bar fight, and was waving his .357 around as he tried to go baack in the bar. The other firearms we secured were from homes in a completely evacuated area, that were unsecureable. Each one was logged, a notice was left in the house, and it was turned over to Louisiana SP... Oh and our AO WAS the area that the gangs were operating in at nighttime, they would transirt where we were to get to the homes that were worth looting. Comr to think of it, I think we saw a total of Five residents who were determined to Shelter in place we'd check on them every day, give them food and water, ans ensure they didnt need medical..other than that we left them alone.

 

[hagar]

I think this one may have survived if it were not for the "How Dare You".

 

[Flash-hider]

Many years ago I was appointed to one of the townships local commissions. I did, and as I was reappointed was asked to, swear an oath not much different from what a police man or soldier, or govenor, or the president would swear to. While it may be looked on that as far as importance, I'm on the bottom end of the pecking order, I still believe in and defend this country because that is what I said I'd do.
The N.O. situation demonstrated to me that some people didn't believe in the moral principle of what they were sworn to uphold. In my mind there is a hugh difference between man made law and God's law. The "Bill of Rights" is God's law, in my belief, and cannot be held subjective to man's desire.
The statement made by the board member to the effect that orders were followed because of financial considerations, this rational is flawed at best. The father's of this country put life, fortune, and moral principle on the line to beat there overlord's back to England.
So what it comes down to is there are at least two different meanings of what we had sworn to do. One being a fairly strict constitutionalist, where not much is given up and the other who's view is that of a living constitution where the meaning ebbs and flows with the times.

 

[alamosaddles]

I think this one may have survived if it were not for the "How Dare You".

Yeah, his "how dare you" demonstrates a Nazi and "I am above the law mentality".

Anyone who supports the illegal firearms confiscation order given by Chief Eddie Compass is a Nazi, a Traitor and clearly does not support the second amendment.

It was clearly an illegal order, and even implying that it should have been followed just because their job was important, or their paycheck needed to be collected is unforgivable.

 

[alamosaddles]

does onyone know HOW many guns were confiscated from PEOPLE during the whole thing?? we only took ONE gun from a person..

There is no way of knowing how many guns exactly were illegally taken. The best one can do, is to review the hundreds of complaints logged with the NOPD from residents who had their firearms taken and not returned.

Though your team only took one firearm, and from what you describe, for good reason, it seems that the confiscation was disorganized at best. Most federal agencies that were assisting in NoLa, refused to take part in the confiscation, while seemingly, some in state and some out of state law enforcement officers took the order from Eddie Compass to be gold and acted on it.

 

[KpdPipes]

There is no way of knowing how many guns exactly were illegally taken. The best one can do, is to review the hundreds of complaints logged with the NOPD from residents who had their firearms taken and not returned.

Though your team only took one firearm, and from what you describe, for good reason, it seems that the confiscation was disorganized at best. Most federal agencies that were assisting in NoLa, refused to take part in the confiscation, while seemingly, some in state and some out of state law enforcement officers took the order from Eddie Compass to be gold and acted on it.

We didnt have any interaction with any other agencies (Including NOPD) while we were there, in the city itself, we dealt ONLY with LSP. We also did regular patrol Duty in the Cities of Kenner and Harahan. FIRST thing we did was establish what Louisiana state laws were in regards to firearms, sinc ethey were (of course) certainly going to be more liberal than we had in NJ. The rest of our time there we followed what we were told, and any questions we checked with the local agency, and had No problems. As far as Compass is concerned..he;s little better than Chocolate Ray IMO. he was initially reported as MIA and there were people looking all over for him in the city during the storm..turns out he had "Shifted his Command Post" to Baton Rouge but without telling anyone. That;s one of the reasons i dont like to condemn the guys who left initially to secure their families...the majority of whome came back..the ones who DIDNT come back. are a different story, but i cant blame some of them for not reporting immediately.