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· Registered
564 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Pay Pal is not supportive of the 2nd Ammendment. But how do you persuade someone who does not support us to drop Pay Pal? Simple. Explain, in traditional interstate commerce, most (mail order) transactions are handled on an F.O.B. basis (Free on Board). The Seller's obligation to the buyer ceases once the the Seller gives the sold item to the post office, presumably upon reciept of the buyer's payment in the sellers home state.

With Pay Pal, payment is tendered in the buyers home state by the direct withdrawl of the buyers home state based bank account. This makes the buyer vulnerable and liable to pay state sales tax in their home state, since payment for the transaction took place in the buyers home state. The seller is still responsible for sales tax in their home state as well.


That is what Paypal is setting up for us and the sooner the people are aware of the slow and gradual encroachment of free interstate commerce, the better.

I had to laugh at some vendors on E-Gay whom limited their auctions to people registered to Gay Pal only. I could have bumped up an auction by another $100.00 if only I were not blocked from the seller from bidding (because I am not registered with Paypal). I am not sad I lost a chance to bid on an item. I voted with my dollars, and that was my small part in the big picture. That is how I got control in a world where most people shrug their shoulders and say "there is nothing I can do about it".

· Moderator
11,878 Posts
one portion of my current position is to head up our ebay sales. this is a good 30-40% of our sales revenue. on every one of the auctions, paypal is a required feature for the bidder. once this was an available option it really did decrease the number of deadbeat bidders by at least 75%. the leads to less wasted admin time trying to collect and relist and all the rest of the crap that you have to deal with.

as much as i am a firearm owner, and supporter, paypal is a must in the online auction industry. that said why are you supporting ebay while not supporting paypal. they are the same company. that is like supporting hillary but not the clintons.


· Registered
2,700 Posts
that said why are you supporting ebay while not supporting paypal. they are the same company. that is like supporting hillary but not the clintons.

Well said, Rory. And precisely why I don't do bidness with any company that deals with E-gay. Nice analogy too....

I love my hobby too much to stab myself in the back. I seem to do quite well without the bastages.

· Premium Member
674 Posts
personally I think some of paypals policies are very bad, such as being able to close your acct and lock up your funds for several months. I did business with them for several years and put a lot of $$$$$ in thier pockets only to be summarily and ignominiously fired as a customer for taking payment for some gun parts sold on auction arms. I also had a major problem getting my $$$ back from a fraudelent seller, they refused to give me a refund because the seller gave tehm a fradulent shiping number. the only way I was able to resolve it was to file a complaint with my cc company

as fro egay, I got screwed by a crook there , he paid, I shipped the goods , he got them and after I posted a positive feed back he disputed the trans action and the funds were retracted, it took 2 months to finally get paid, in that time I complained to egay as well as some other people he screwed and he is still buying and selling there.

· Registered
480 Posts
you should see the some of the new rules that was posted. regarding feedback. I found it: http://www.reloadersauction.com/announcements,page,79,topic_id,content_pages

I just wanted to rant a bit about the 'Auction Giant"....Ebay.....or to me FEEBAY....I Like most people here dropped them like a bad habit when they went totally ANTI-2nd Amendment.....hence the reason we created Reloadersauction.....It just pisses me off that they are turning their backs (AGAIN) on the people who made them what they are today....

Feebay has gotten "too big for their britches".....These guys will never stop......several years ago they got "politically correct" and banned the sale of all firearms.....2007 they just crossed over to totally ANTI-2nd Amendment and banned the sale of "Any part or accessory that is required for a gun to fire"....And as of the last several weeks, they have lost their damn minds....

One of the new and weird tactics is that Feebay implemented a new and increased fee schedule (as if their fees were not high enough) and have tried to push the smaller and more personal "table top" dealers out all together......who do these pricks think put them where they are today........THE SMALL GUYS!!....

The last thing they have done is just plain STUPID!!!!!......they have changed their feedback policy so that NO SELLER CAN LEAVE NEGATIVE FEEDBACK TO A DEADBEAT BUYER......

Now I didn't graduate at the top of my class.....but is Honest comments not the reason for a feedback system?????....To make it a safer buyer and seller market???....here is what the new policy is going to be...(I got this from a Poll on Feebay's site)

"eBay is in the process of rolling out new changes to the Feedback system. These changes include:

* Buyers will only be able to receive positive Feedback. (WTF???)

* Positive repeat customer Feedback will count (up to 1 Feedback from the same buyer per week.) (I SEE FEEDBACK TAMPERING)

* Feedback more than 12-months old won't count towards your Feedback percentage. (AGAIN....WTF???)

* When a buyer doesn't respond to the Unpaid Item (UPI) process the negative or neutral Feedback they have left for that transaction will be removed. ( This may be OK)

* When a member is suspended, all their negative and neutral Feedback will be removed. (???....)

* Buyers must wait 3 days before leaving negative or neutral Feedback for sellers with an established track record, to encourage communication.

* All Feedback must be left within 60 days (compared to 90 days today) of listing end to encourage timely Feedback and discourage abuse.

* Buyers will be held more accountable when sellers report an unpaid item or commit other policy violations. (WHATEVER!)

(AND THEN ASKED THIS STUPID QUESTION) Overall, what effect do you think these upcoming changes to the Feedback system will have on your ability to trust the feedback system?"


· Registered
480 Posts
Also found this:

March 14, 2008 | 11:40AM PST/PT

John McDonald
Hi everyone, I'm John McDonald with the US Trust and Safety team. As Jim Ambach, VP of Seller Experience, outlined in his announcement in January, we're making some changes that are intended to make the buying experience on eBay better and safer. As part of this initiative, expanded safer payment requirements are scheduled to go into effect on March 17.

Since January 2007, all new sellers have been required to offer PayPal or a merchant credit card as a payment option to their buyers. On March 17, this policy will be expanded to sellers or items when they meet one or more of the following conditions:

# the seller has higher than 5% buyer dissatisfaction rates
# the seller has less than 100 feedback
# the items are listed in categories with higher rates of buyer complaints, including: Gift Certificates, Video Games, Cell Phones, Computers and Consumer Electronics.

In addition, for a small number of transactions that have a higher risk of buyer dissatisfaction, we may delay the release of funds paid through PayPal. This hold will be placed on only a small percentage of transactions for up to 21 days. Then the funds will be released if there is no dispute. The funds may be released earlier if the buyer leaves positive feedback, or if PayPal can confirm delivery of the item. Sellers enrolled in the PayPal Money Market Fund will earn interest on any pending funds in their PayPal accounts.

Your payments will not be held if you meet the following requirements:

* You have been an eBay member for 6 months or more, and
* Your total Feedback score is 100 or greater, and
* Your buyer dissatisfaction percentage is less than 5%.


* Your average DSR is 4.5 or greater and
* Your have received 20 or more DSRs in the last 12 months.

I know that there have been questions among our Community about payment holds. Monroe Labouisse, my colleague at PayPal, explains holds in further detail on his post to the PayPal blog – I definitely encourage you to read it.

For more information about safer payment requirements in general, see the safer payments section of our FAQ.


John McDonald
eBay Trust & Safety

I just say whatever........when I have sold something on ebay I transfer the money from paypal to my account. if I suspect something is going south I'll have my account at the bank frozen.

· Registered
69 Posts
I stopped doing buisness with both EBay and PayPal about a year after I started. I was working on my old Honda at the time, and ordered a few parts from the same person, one after another, and paid separately. On the third order, despite the fact that I was charged, he never received payment, and my account was closed due to suspected fraud. Cost me $120 or so. Needless to say I'm not willing to use their fraudulent service any more, even when it's the only way to get something that I want, or if it costs me twice as much to get it from somewhere else.
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