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Discussion Starter #1
Are 1919a4 right sideplates registered for a given caliber when a 1919a4 is constructed? I am wondering if the new assault gun ban is passed, if it might make it necessary to keep the gun in the caliber it was originally created.

I'm wondering if it might be useful to register it from the beginning as "multi" for caliber, like some of the AR lowers.
 

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Are you talking about semi auto 1919A4 or Full Auto? Full autos cannot be made or registered unless the side plate was registered before 1986. if it was you can probably do just about anything you wish with calibers just so you don't change the markings on the side plate.

Semi autos are not registered at all at this point. The manufacturer probably keeps a record by serial number and a gun dealer who sells it has to keep records also but there is no central registration place for them unless your state has such a requirement. Just like any other firearm you can change the caliber any time you wish.

Even under the 1994 assault weapons ban there was no requirement for registration. It only prohibited the manufacture or importation of certain weapons. I do not know what the gun banners have in mind for any such new law. We may be lucky to just keep what we have. Any registration would of course be the first step towards confiscation.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I'm talking about the semi-auto version. I'm talking about what is entered in the caliber section on the Form 1?

The scenario I am thinking about may not apply to the semi-auto 1919a4.
 

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Why bother with a Form-1? Are you making a "Short Barrelled" 1919 conversion?
 

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Just to make the record straight: F/A side plates can be made and registered today. I've made and registered several. Keep in mind of course that when one does this, you have created a "Post Sample" gun that is highly restricted to who can receive it. It can only go to class a 3 dealer with a "Law Enforcement Demo Letter" or a Law Enforcement Dept. Of course in order to do this, the mfg. must be a 07/02. Hate to be a nitpicker, and you probably meant that a F/A plate cannot be mfg. today and be "transferable" to an individual. Believe me, there have been many 1919 RSPs mfg. and registered since 1986. In reference to the "Caliber Markings" on a F/A gun, I simply put .30 Cal. This works for 30-06, .308 & 7.62X54R.
"MUCKER"
Are you talking about semi auto 1919A4 or Full Auto? Full autos cannot be made or registered unless the side plate was registered before 1986. if it was you can probably do just about anything you wish with calibers just so you don't change the markings on the side plate.

Semi autos are not registered at all at this point. The manufacturer probably keeps a record by serial number and a gun dealer who sells it has to keep records also but there is no central registration place for them unless your state has such a requirement. Just like any other firearm you can change the caliber any time you wish.

Even under the 1994 assault weapons ban there was no requirement for registration. It only prohibited the manufacture or importation of certain weapons. I do not know what the gun banners have in mind for any such new law. We may be lucky to just keep what we have. Any registration would of course be the first step towards confiscation.
 

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Thanks mucker for making that clear. Yes of course a manufacturer or someone who has obtained a license to make a machine gun may do so. They just can't sell it to an individual (other than a dealer). I guess they can be transfered to a "corporation" and also to the police or military. Also a registered DEWAT machine guns can be made live by obtaining a license to manufacture a machine guns and since they are already registered they do not fall under the post 86 category unless the law has changed, someone correct me if I am wrong.
 

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Along the same lines

So I am in the process of building a 1919 using a plate that was less than 80% and hence unregistered. If I never plan on selling it and keeping it as my "personal build" can I just assign it a serial number? Can I give it the serial #7.62 since that's already on the left side plate - ha ha

KW
 

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A letter from ATF posted on line last year has a paragraph that states:

"Also, for your information, a nonlicensee may manufacture a semiautomatic rifle for his or her own personal use. As long as the firearm remains in the cutody of the person who manufactured it, the firearm need not be marked with a serial number or name and location of the manufacturer. However, if the firearm is transferred to another party at some point in the future, the firearm must be marked in accordance with the provisions set forth in 27 CFR s 478.92 (formerly 178.92)".

The ATF Letter was dated November 19, 2004.
 

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Hello All, while on the subject of Approval Letters, most that have been seen are for .30 cal, and once I saw ORF ? one in 8 mm Mauser as well.
I had an earlier No welding required Letter that I got from somewhere on this site, and it is no longer there... Also, someone had borrowed my hard copy of it, ( to make themselves a copy ) and it is also not here. If there is some one who has posted an earlier 1919 ATF no welding required Letter, I would greatly appreciate if you tel me where it is on this site. Thank you for any help. Jim. PM and Email is OK also.
 

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Yes, old thread, and this is happening a lot. That said, let me address the new post. First of all, in my opinion, the whole approval letter thing is overrated. I've had that conversation with the now-former Asst Chief of the Firearms Technology Branch, re a project I was working on. He told me, point blank, that I didn't need a letter. If a manufacturer wants one for CYA purposes, fine. For a home builder, it serves little purpose. The caliber of the gun is not going to impact anything related to a letter either, and if some agency seizes your gun no letter will help. All that will matter is that your gun proves to function in semi auto only. If you have a gun built by XYZ Mfg, a letter from XYZ Mfg may be a nice thing to have, but it would be a rare circumstance if that stops some LEO who wants to take your hardware. If you have a range SO or manager who is pressing the matter, you need a different range to go to.

The no-weld issue is so old now that I can't imagine a circumstance where it would matter. A lot of stuff like that is no longer available on this site, some of which may relate to the recent remodel and some was gone before that. I do have the letter in question, in digital form. I can send it to you if you want to drop me a line. But if you have a gun that is riveted together, the welding issue is not likely to even come to mind, being a matter settled 15 years ago. That whole welding thing was largely related to screw builds, which were popular for full auto post sample builds at one time, and so carried over to semis in some cases. Yes, some licensed semi builders had welding in their approvals, because no one had asked the question yet on that point. Thanks to forum member 7.62x51, aka Orin, that all went away long, long ago. He was the one to put the question to ATF Technology Branch, who confirmed that riveting is considered permanent assembly, therefore welding was not required.
 

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There has been a lot of this since the site changed over. If you do a search the oldest stuff shows up first instead of the latest, it's messed upo_O
Yes, old thread, and this is happening a lot. That said, let me address the new post. First of all, in my opinion, the whole approval letter thing is overrated. I've had that conversation with the now-former Asst Chief of the Firearms Technology Branch, re a project I was working on. He told me, point blank, that I didn't need a letter. If a manufacturer wants one for CYA purposes, fine. For a home builder, it serves little purpose. The caliber of the gun is not going to impact anything related to a letter either, and if some agency seizes your gun no letter will help. All that will matter is that your gun proves to function in semi auto only. If you have a gun built by XYZ Mfg, a letter from XYZ Mfg may be a nice thing to have, but it would be a rare circumstance if that stops some LEO who wants to take your hardware. If you have a range SO or manager who is pressing the matter, you need a different range to go to.

The no-weld issue is so old now that I can't imagine a circumstance where it would matter. A lot of stuff like that is no longer available on this site, some of which may relate to the recent remodel and some was gone before that. I do have the letter in question, in digital form. I can send it to you if you want to drop me a line. But if you have a gun that is riveted together, the welding issue is not likely to even come to mind, being a matter settled 15 years ago. That whole welding thing was largely related to screw builds, which were popular for full auto post sample builds at one time, and so carried over to semis in some cases. Yes, some licensed semi builders had welding in their approvals, because no one had asked the question yet on that point. Thanks to forum member 7.62x51, aka Orin, that all went away long, long ago. He was the one to put the question to ATF Technology Branch, who confirmed that riveting is considered permanent assembly, therefore welding was not required.
Thanks for responding all, and specifically Lucky#13, as far as registering a home built firearm, cal or other designations, for personal use, ( not for sale or for transfer,) from what I understand in AZ at least, none is required, but to stamp some unique identifying info on the same is possibly a good idea, in case there is a dispute as to who is the owner of this device, or if it is stolen or needs to be insured. ( this can be kept in your personal records, until, and unless it is needed to be used by you for whatever reason. ( this info needs not be registered or filed with any agency in AZ, or fed.) I do understand that this no weld issue is old, and had been settled years ago, I was just hoping to have a hard copy to be able to point to, for those who absolutely must see it in official form, for them self. ( There are people like that, and nothing else will overcome their concern...) If you have the digital version of the no weld letter, I would greatly appreciate it if you can send me one. My Email is:
Jmikls at Hotmail.com Thank you for your help. Jim.
 

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Wow the board has turned into the way back machine lol I wondered why all the old threads kept coming up all of a sudden.
 

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I've been pre-occupied and away for a few months. Coming back and trying to get comfortable with the new format........my head hurts.
 

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Thanks for responding all, and specifically Lucky#13, as far as registering a home built firearm, cal or other designations, for personal use, ( not for sale or for transfer,) from what I understand in AZ at least, none is required, but to stamp some unique identifying info on the same is possibly a good idea, in case there is a dispute as to who is the owner of this device, or if it is stolen or needs to be insured. ( this can be kept in your personal records, until, and unless it is needed to be used by you for whatever reason. ( this info needs not be registered or filed with any agency in AZ, or fed.) I do understand that this no weld issue is old, and had been settled years ago, I was just hoping to have a hard copy to be able to point to, for those who absolutely must see it in official form, for them self. ( There are people like that, and nothing else will overcome their concern...) If you have the digital version of the no weld letter, I would greatly appreciate it if you can send me one. My Email is:
Jmikls at Hotmail.com Thank you for your help. Jim.
Thank you for the copy of the letter Lucky#13, I got it and it seems to be what we were looking for, in black and white.
While the new version of this site is very different from the previous one, I am hoping to learn to use it good enough to be able to find things that I need to find. Also, if this is a work in progress, the people who are working on it will over time improve/fix some of the more obvious issues, as those are found. That seems to be the process for most websites being redone, whatever their topic is. Thanks again for the quick response Lucky#13. Jim.
 

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Thanks for responding all, and specifically Lucky#13, as far as registering a home built firearm, cal or other designations, for personal use, ( not for sale or for transfer,) from what I understand in AZ at least, none is required, but to stamp some unique identifying info on the same is possibly a good idea, in case there is a dispute as to who is the owner of this device, or if it is stolen or needs to be insured. ( this can be kept in your personal records, until, and unless it is needed to be used by you for whatever reason. ( this info needs not be registered or filed with any agency in AZ, or fed.) I do understand that this no weld issue is old, and had been settled years ago, I was just hoping to have a hard copy to be able to point to, for those who absolutely must see it in official form, for them self. ( There are people like that, and nothing else will overcome their concern...) If you have the digital version of the no weld letter, I would greatly appreciate it if you can send me one. My Email is:
Jmikls at Hotmail.com Thank you for your help. Jim.
Replying to an old thread with the Old Letters In case any one else wants to see them .....Here they are.......

AZB
BrowningLetter.jpg
BrowningLetter2.jpg
BrowningLetterDelta.jpg
BrowningLetterDelta2.jpg
 
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