[Nathan w. Jones]

ANYBODY HERE EVER HEARD OF WISE LITE ARMS OR MILITARY GUN SUPPLY?

I worked for Wise Lite Arms for 8 months and in that time I designed the semi-auto ppsh-41(kpnj-41),kp-44(kpnj-44) the bren, ZB-26/30, and the semi auto pkm for VLTOR.I also built the prototype dp-28 for Wise Lite Arms on MR.Dennise Rickee's design (sorry if not spelled correctly)for ATF APROVAL I'm the guy on ar15.com shooting the semi kp-44 and the dp-28.All that aside .I stoppedworking for MR. Anthony Wendling (owner WISE LITE ARMS) After I found out that he and MR.Eric Robb (owner MILITAR GUN SUPPLY) were selling illegalfirearms. They were also defrauding the public by selling DP-28 parts kitsas biuldable kits if you purchased the barrel bushing that is for sale on weaponeer.The truth is that ALL OF THE BUILDABLE KITS HAVE BEEN TAKEN BUY WISE LITE ARMS.And the kits that MGS are selling are not buildable becouse of the location of the torch cuts through the barrel take down button.They are not telling the truth.
Mr.Wendling has tried to have me arrested on four occasions under the false pretense that I STOLE MY DESIGNS FROM HIS COMPANY ,WICH NEVER PAID ME FOR THEM.He has called my former employers including close personal friends of myself and my wife and tried to slander me ,So my only choice is to air the dirty laundry in public forums with honest people and let you guys decide who is not telling the truth ( anybody seen a semi dp-28/kp-44/ppsh-41 from any of these two?? didnt think so becouse they are mine and if you guy's want a copy of design and the prints + ATF APPROVAL I will email it to
youfor free.

Nathan Jones

 

[weaponeer]

They were also defrauding the public by selling DP-28 parts kitsas biuldable kits if you purchased the barrel bushing that is for sale on weaponeer.The truth is that ALL OF THE BUILDABLE KITS HAVE BEEN TAKEN BUY WISE LITE ARMS.

I have a problem with this statement, as in my opinion (based on many posts on the subject) it is not correct.

Not everyone in the group buy for DP-28's needed the bushing... actually a low percentage actually bothered ordering the bushings.

Another issue is the barrel bushing is not required to build the kit... without the barrel bushing you need to permanently weld the barrel in place, but with the bushing you could replace the barrel is needed down the road.

The DP28 kits came from MGS

The Bushing came from WLA

The reason WLA made the bushing is due to the demil through the threads on the DP-28.. They didn't make the bushing just so builders could build kits.

Another problem about the post above is that WLA didn't purchase any DP-28 kits from MGS. WLA is the contractor for building the DP-28 kits.

I also know the details of the DP-28 semi design between all parties and it's 100% above board.

Just my 2 cents, but public bashing of companies and/or individuals who help our sport (no matter who they are) does not help any of us.

 

[glock17_shooter]

Mr Nathan Jones, I cannot give a lot of weight on your post. Unless, you informed WISE LITE ARMS OR MILITARY GUN SUPPLY that you will post this here so that they are able to respond?

FYI for everyone. I do not know Nathan Jones nor anyone at WISE LITE ARMS OR MILITARY GUN SUPPLY. I just do not like people bashing others when the other parties cannot respond.

 

[Nathan w. Jones]

Sorry Gerry but you didnt work there and you also dont know all the details

Gerry I worked there and did all of the design work .I'm sorry to say but Eric Robb told myself and Tony Wendling(WISE LITE ARMS)"That $295.00 was to much to pay some ******* for each gun that I sell."So if you have any Questiosns about me being correct or not E-mail MR. Rickee about how much money he recived on the 50 that MILITARY GUN SUPPLY HAS TAKEN PAYMENT FOR.
P.S. WHO IS PAYING THE F.E.T.?????????

 

[KeythL]

Take legal action...

...He has called my former employers including close personal friends of myself and my wife and tried to slander me ,So my only choice is to air the dirty laundry in public forums with honest people and let you guys decide who is not telling the truth...
Nathan Jones

Actually, if what you post is factual your proper recourse would be to hire legal council and sue for libel (and there are plenty of attorneys that work on congengency...so not having the money for an attorney isn't a valid counter argument).

Keyth

 

[Nathan w. Jones]

yeah Im full of it thats why I used my whole name.

I'ts already happening and thats I'll I can say about it until thh court date

 

[762x51]

Hi Nathan,

Sorry to hear that you had to leave WLA under these circumstances and I hope everything works out well for you.

I'm glad to hear that you have gotten a lawyer and it's probably best that you keep the details off the boards at this time - I'm sure your lawyer will tell you the same thing.

Weaponeer - Nathan did not say that WLA purchased the DP kits, he said that all of the buildable kits were taken by WLA. This is understandable as they are using them to build the semi DP's for MGS.

Glock17 Shooter - MGS and WLA monitor the boards, including this one, and even if they didn't there are folks here that would let them know of the post.

Regards,
Orin

 

[EZFEED]

Damn

There seems to be allot of this going around nowadays. Homebuilders should quit or maybe not so much as quit because that would be just what the other guys would want us to do but just quit posting and sharing what they have created until they can apply a patent or seek other legal Protection. This whole thing is so depressing if true but hey, that's why I quit a long time ago.

Mr. Nathan W. Jones,

First off all why, why, didn't you cover your ass in your part of the development of these weapons? Anytime you give birth to a idea with intent to sell to the general public you MUST have the forethought to protect yourself. I feel for you bud and hope right triumphs in this case but you'll have a fight ahead of you. Still don't confuse me for taking any sides because I myself have conflicting information that I've gathered over time but I'm not about to interject it here just yet.

Now you say you submitted these for reclassification to the BATFTB. If your name is on the reclassification letter and you didn't sign some contract with MGS that releases you from custody of them then you're home free and you scant have need to post anything here or on any public forum unless it's just to muster support.......or gain sympathy.
You're home free you see because that little watermarked reclassification letter showing your name is a full fledged legal document and absolute proof of origin and you can bring that to court anyday. Hell I wouldn't even take restitiution in a case where I'd have that, I'd just carry them to court laughing all the way.

Now if you submitted the samples under the company letterhead (and that would be silly even if you are using the companies 07FFL because ATF will still allow you to be issued a letter acknowledging you as the builder or designer if you explain the circumstances) then you have surely done yourself a disservice but even then this is still quite fightable.

I'd like to hear MGS's side of this as well.

 

[loboslanding]

Mr. Jones, I'd show your post on this website to your lawyer and see what he says about the prudence of doing it. Just my .02.

 

[slowfire]

 

[Upandatum]

Nat

If your in a civil suit, are you even aloud to be talking about it ?

This thread could be used against you (I think)....

I'd keep it mum till the judge sorts it out...

Good luck man...

Tim

 

[pfc15]

Interesting

I just called MGS today and they would not sell a DP-28 to a California dealer even though the gun itself is not a banned arm here with the flash cone taken off and without the mag (I have a 'lifetime' supply of hi cap mags)....maybe they did me a favor by not taking my money for a gun they do not have in stock or have built and maybe have a proprietary claim against......they certainly didn't have a good explanation for not selling to me other than "the ATF tells us what to do..." They didn't sound like someone I want to do business with.....

 

[JBaum]

Not picking sides here - I don't have a horse in this race at all, but if you're working for someone, isn't the fruit of that work the property of the employer? I may have missed something here.

 

[shortround]

Not picking sides here - I don't have a horse in this race at all, but if you're working for someone, isn't the fruit of that work the property of the employer? I may have missed something here.

Exactly. If I work for GM and design an engine, the legal rights to that design are GM's, not mine. You may not have a legal leg to stand on, but I wouldn't discuss anything in a public venue if it were involved in a legal battle. You would be doing yourself a disservice.

 

[ohioblacksheep]

JBaum
Wondered about that myself. I've signed a lot of those papers over the years...Lou

 

[EZFEED]

Not picking sides here - I don't have a horse in this race at all, but if you're working for someone, isn't the fruit of that work the property of the employer? I may have missed something here.

Damn J,,,,,,,you're pretty much right.

Unless he made an agreement otherwise then you are absolutley right

Here at Halliburton we have to sign a waiver outlining just that. It sucks but they have a point. You wouldn't have been working on it or had the idea if you weren't working for us and put in the envionment where such ideas could foster is usualy what they'll say. They do give us one time bonuses up to $500 though, I wish it were royalties. Sucks but thats the way it is.

Nathan you might just be stuck.

 

[ODA 564]

Under some circumstances it could be joint intellectual property. It depends on the relationship between the person and the firm (employee, contractor) and any agreements or lack thereof.

Rarely would it be the individual's intellectual property unless it was developed outside of work without involvement of the business who employed him (like a golf club designed on his own time by a aerospace engineer who works for Boeing and his work does not involve golf equipment design).

 

[Kali Komrade]

Not the place for a battle of words

I believe they call it slander when you say incorrect information about an entity in the public (whether its correct or not is not up to us) I would change that top post. I just ordered a T&S from them the other day and may have been hesitant if I would have seen this post first but I want to try there design it looks good. As for designing something in someone elses shop if your using there materials there tooling and shop time its there's unless you have an agreement or rent shop time and pay for materials used... I think thats common sense. I work at a print shop from time to time and anything that is created in the shop belongs to the shop it is not my intellectual property but belongs to the business and that agreement is well over 200 years old...

And if you want to ever cover your own butt working in facility never make a design so good that it can't be improved, because it only takes a couple of changes on a product for the government to issue a new patent...

 

[oldtirediron]

My .02 cents !!

Most of the guys in the ""Gun Business""; that at least design stuff and offer their designs out honestly are just that-- nice honest guys-- Unfortunately others are "" Snakes in the grass "" That will take advantage and profit from your ideas etc. unfortunately a patent is only good enough to hang on your wall as a decoration-- 20 years ago I was in process of getting a patent for a AR-15 part-- a part any AR-15 shooter would recognise today but the whole idea was stolen from me period; and I wasted a ton of money trying to defend my IDEA-- Others profited from it and are still profiting from it today-- Seems the big money guys do what they want -- and take a big cow poop on the idea man throughout the designer etc !