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I am looking to buy a hand cart for the 1917a1 water cooled. Does anyone know what one is worth? Also I would appreciate any help finding one in any condition.
Thanks, Bob
Thanks, Bob
WTK: value of a M3A1 or M4A1 hand cart
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M3 Hand Carts
I too have looked at these for a while. Most fellows that have a restored complete cart....know their worth. If its complete with the leg brackets for the 1917 Tripod, all straps, and correct tires.....they average between,
$3000 on the cheap side to $4500-5000 on the high side. The leg brackets are so rare that Hayes Autopaulic (sorry Hayes) of Montana took an original set and had them reproduced...and offers them. Most of these neat carts when surplused after the Wars.....were stripped of any and all straps and brackets that stuck out so the could be used as garden carts and such.
Good luck on your search,
never say never and never quit looking.
TiredIron
I too have looked at these for a while. Most fellows that have a restored complete cart....know their worth. If its complete with the leg brackets for the 1917 Tripod, all straps, and correct tires.....they average between,
$3000 on the cheap side to $4500-5000 on the high side. The leg brackets are so rare that Hayes Autopaulic (sorry Hayes) of Montana took an original set and had them reproduced...and offers them. Most of these neat carts when surplused after the Wars.....were stripped of any and all straps and brackets that stuck out so the could be used as garden carts and such.
Good luck on your search,
never say never and never quit looking.
TiredIron
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236 Posts
Thanks for the heads up! I know that 15 years ago the carts were around the $500 price range. I just wasn't sure what the prices had done.
Bob
Bob
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Craig Johnson said:
some nice picture of different carts, I didn't even know things like that existed.......so how were these used? just by the name of it, I would assume they were used to cart MG around with their tripods around the battlefield, but not used to fire off.
that M3A4 cart looks simple enough, you probably could fabricate one
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Congrats to Craig
Wow that really gets me excited, I was all set to make a simple wood box for my 1917 but this has got me thinking I need wheels! Craig I see that on your web site one of the 1917 carts, the wooden one with the what looks like a vickers residing in it has been totally restored. have you ever made a set of plans off of one of these carts? Some buddies of mine here have made spoked wheeled cannon carriges for their cannons. This doesent look a hole lot different.
Wow that really gets me excited, I was all set to make a simple wood box for my 1917 but this has got me thinking I need wheels! Craig I see that on your web site one of the 1917 carts, the wooden one with the what looks like a vickers residing in it has been totally restored. have you ever made a set of plans off of one of these carts? Some buddies of mine here have made spoked wheeled cannon carriges for their cannons. This doesent look a hole lot different.
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The carts were intended to be shot from. Think it was a great idea on paper ,but for all practical purposes it was just a good way to transport them around over fairly smooth surfaces ,and for training.
In most of the watercool related books there is mention of makeing a "T" base out of wood ,sticking the 1917 tripod on it ,and putting sandbags on all 3 legs to hold the tripod down. I believe the M1 machine gun mount (cart) was developed out of this idea around 1930. Here is a quote from "Machine Gunners Manual 1936".
M1 cart
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"When taking posts, the members of the squad have equipment as for advanced gun drill, except that No. 4 has the aiming stakes, the spare parts roll and two boxes of amumunition and No. 5 has a T-base, a shovel and three sandbags.
Infantry units equiped with the new type cart (M1) embodying the steel T-base, may use it in place of a wooden improvised T-base. When steel T-base is used in battery drill, it is optional with the instructor whether the tripod and gun be removed from the T-base, or the assembled T-base, tripod, and gun, be handled as a unit."
There are some pretty good line drawings of the wood model of 1917 cart ,but the are no dimensions.
Here is a description of the M3A4 series
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Thanks for the compliments. Its alot of work, scanning, uploading (Thanks you highspeed internet) Most of the black and white pictures of handcarts are from real photos I own or from books I own.
Craig
In most of the watercool related books there is mention of makeing a "T" base out of wood ,sticking the 1917 tripod on it ,and putting sandbags on all 3 legs to hold the tripod down. I believe the M1 machine gun mount (cart) was developed out of this idea around 1930. Here is a quote from "Machine Gunners Manual 1936".
M1 cart
"When taking posts, the members of the squad have equipment as for advanced gun drill, except that No. 4 has the aiming stakes, the spare parts roll and two boxes of amumunition and No. 5 has a T-base, a shovel and three sandbags.
Infantry units equiped with the new type cart (M1) embodying the steel T-base, may use it in place of a wooden improvised T-base. When steel T-base is used in battery drill, it is optional with the instructor whether the tripod and gun be removed from the T-base, or the assembled T-base, tripod, and gun, be handled as a unit."
There are some pretty good line drawings of the wood model of 1917 cart ,but the are no dimensions.
Here is a description of the M3A4 series
Thanks for the compliments. Its alot of work, scanning, uploading (Thanks you highspeed internet) Most of the black and white pictures of handcarts are from real photos I own or from books I own.
Craig
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That site is awesome, you did a lot of work collecting that stuff. Congrats!!!
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